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Heroes & Gods (board game question/discussion)


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OK, I found a crowdfunded board game that looks fascinating to me, but I'm VERY curious to see what some of the more discerning board game fans here think of it.  

https://app.crowdox.com/projects/fanaticgamelabs/heroes-and-gods-the-master-of-dreams?fbclid=IwAR3RLq3V3q4iWb4msL97leHR9wWv4GWEcjPyTByEoX4UKor1CEAcrlp7i2s


I wish it could work with more than 4 players.    Are there any other games this one reminds you guys of, particularly in the way players can choose whether or not to work together?    Thoughts/reviews/hype?   @Soluna very curious to hear your take on this!

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I've spent a few minutes looking around and I have found literally no discussions or references to this game on any serious boardgaming site which is honestly kind of bizarre.

 

This honestly looks like a typical cash-grab kickstarter game with tons of flashy looking components and relatively shallow gameplay for serious boardgamers. The publisher (Fanatic Game Labs) and designer (Ionut Loghin) are basically unknown which means a lot in the hobby and is generally somewhat of a red flag. The rulebook and description are entirely full of shallow buzzwords with literally no explanation to how some fairly lofty mechanics are supposed to tie together. The core game mechanics, panning over the kickstarter, are REALLY simple and it seems that they intentionally are hiding information in the original kickstarter campaign to have the art and "fake" complexity make up for what is a very simple game.

 

There's no gameplay video which reinforces my above point. The game is shallow, they know it, and don't want to make it super obvious.

 

I looked through the available rule book and dear god this game is random as fuck, Combat escalation mechanics are all top deck nonsense.

 

The classic indication that a boardgame sucks is that it tries to be "semi-coop". This basically never works as intended and as Tom Vasel puts it is nonsense. Make a good coop game or a good competitive game. Don't try to half ass both of them. (This doesn't mean a competitive game can't have a coop variation which is quite common).

 

I wouldn't touch this shit with a ten foot pole. Boardgames are in an insane state of bloat right now with people trying to milk people who look at art and themes without reading into rules or production. The fact that there's literally no hype about this game, with no comments, but 3 reviews of a near-perfect score (one of which is from the designer) is a giant GTFO flag.

 

@Broletariat would also likely provide good input based on my discussions with him in the past.

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Games that I know are better and are in a similar vein would be something like the following, broken down by category:

  • Competitive MOBA-likes: Guards of Atlantis II
  • Semi-Coop One-Session Adventures: Nemesis
  • Competitive Dudes-on-a-Map: Lords of Hellas, Kemet
  • Adventure (particularly solo gaming): Mage Knight
  • Epic Month-Long Campaign: Tainted Grail, Gloomhaven

I think Gloomhaven most provides what you want and is likely the most proven game. It's currently the most popular game that exists for a reason and the 1.5 rules update Gloomhaven: Jaws of the Lion is probably a great starting point.

 

Mechanics are insanely variable but I'm aiming to provide some games here that are "hero" type players that are customizable in some way.

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1 hour ago, Soluna said:

I've spent a few minutes looking around and I have found literally no discussions or references to this game on any serious boardgaming site which is honestly kind of bizarre.

 

This honestly looks like a typical cash-grab kickstarter game with tons of flashy looking components and relatively shallow gameplay for serious boardgamers. The publisher (Fanatic Game Labs) and designer (Ionut Loghin) are basically unknown which means a lot in the hobby and is generally somewhat of a red flag. The rulebook and description are entirely full of shallow buzzwords with literally no explanation to how some fairly lofty mechanics are supposed to tie together. The core game mechanics, panning over the kickstarter, are REALLY simple and it seems that they intentionally are hiding information in the original kickstarter campaign to have the art and "fake" complexity make up for what is a very simple game.

 

There's no gameplay video which reinforces my above point. The game is shallow, they know it, and don't want to make it super obvious.

 

I looked through the available rule book and dear god this game is random as fuck, Combat escalation mechanics are all top deck nonsense.

 

The classic indication that a boardgame sucks is that it tries to be "semi-coop". This basically never works as intended and as Tom Vasel puts it is nonsense. Make a good coop game or a good competitive game. Don't try to half ass both of them. (This doesn't mean a competitive game can't have a coop variation which is quite common).

 

I wouldn't touch this shit with a ten foot pole. Boardgames are in an insane state of bloat right now with people trying to milk people who look at art and themes without reading into rules or production. The fact that there's literally no hype about this game, with no comments, but 3 reviews of a near-perfect score (one of which is from the designer) is a giant GTFO flag.

 

@Broletariat would also likely provide good input based on my discussions with him in the past.

Exactly what I was curious about.  This is why I asked, I just don't have the perspective, and I have to admit, flashy metal coins and graphics had me intrigued.  But if there's no substance, there's no game.  Thanks for looking into it!

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1 hour ago, Soluna said:

Games that I know are better and are in a similar vein would be something like the following, broken down by category:

  • Competitive MOBA-likes: Guards of Atlantis II
  • Semi-Coop One-Session Adventures: Nemesis
  • Competitive Dudes-on-a-Map: Lords of Hellas, Kemet
  • Adventure (particularly solo gaming): Mage Knight
  • Epic Month-Long Campaign: Tainted Grail, Gloomhaven

I think Gloomhaven most provides what you want and is likely the most proven game. It's currently the most popular game that exists for a reason and the 1.5 rules update Gloomhaven: Jaws of the Lion is probably a great starting point.

 

Mechanics are insanely variable but I'm aiming to provide some games here that are "hero" type players that are customizable in some way.

I'm going to start by looking into Gloomhaven, Kemet, and Mage Knight.  

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22 minutes ago, rabidsnowman said:

I'm going to start by looking into Gloomhaven, Kemet, and Mage Knight.  

 

Mage Knight is one of those adventure-y mostly-solo one-off games thats been great for a long time just be aware that the rulebook is absolutely atrocious and if you have no experience with heavy games will feel like you're trying to read some sort of military code. Watch a video on how to play is usually the tip for awful rule books.

 

I would highly suggest trying Gloomhaven Jaws of the Lion, it's even available at Target!

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Be really careful going through Kickstarter for boardgames because a lot of it *looks* great but you end up with some pretty horrible shit fairly often. I think anyone deep into the hobby has developed their own eye for evaluation but it takes a lot of experience going through the typical cycle of boardgaming.

 

Find a game you love -> buy all the games you find that are even 1% interesting to you -> find you only like a few mechanics -> buy kickstarters around those mechanics -> find you only like a few kickstarters -> zen collection of curated games you love

 

I promise you every single person who gets into this hobby goes through the above and I'm sure @Broletariat can vouch. It's some sort of bizarre trap.

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If youre looking for a pretty well done thematic co op deck builder my wife and I have just gotten https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/199042/harry-potter-hogwarts-battle 

 

and have played through the last 2 weekends. 2 players is kinda not as challenging, but we both played 2 heroes (there are Hermione, Neville, Harry and Ron in the base game) and playing with all 4 at once adds a good level of challenge. 

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