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    Addition of a Minor League


    Soluna
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    I would like to add an 8 team minor league if we manage to get more players to provide another source of development for the league (in both sim players and players).

     

    The league would require each team to have a GM and a Head Coach. The ownership would be run by the league (i.e. me and jacobs).

     

    Game reports would be simplified (stats only currently with no full box score) and the sim rules (GM and Coaching with no scouting) would be a simplified version of the NFLHC rules (to be decided).

     

    I would like the "Minor League" to take place in the gap between regular seasons with some overlap with the Minor League then having further development opportunities during the NFLHC season.

     

    Would people support this? I want to cultivate some newer people to play and I think it would be a good bridge to get started (or to be involved if you have slightly less time than the demanding roles for NFLHC).

    If so I would like to see if people would be more interested in voting for custom teams that are in either the US (USFL style) or Europe (NFL Europe style).

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    I definitely think it would be cool should we get an influx of people. My main question would be how rosters are filled. Just fill it with undrafted folks and those still in FA? I know I'd personally want the ability to like, maybe select a player to go play in that league. Could give all the teams a player (or more) to send to the league. 

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    All for setting up some kind of training ground for new players.  Unfortunately, the "Scout" positions, which are a great training ground to be shown the ropes, from the inside of a team, only have 9 of the 32 teams with someone in those roles at the moment, if the wiki is accurate.

     

    But anything that might slow down the schedule for NFLHC, I would be very much against.  We are an impatient lot, constantly asking for more info to be released, and yesterday, for all things pertaining to the offseason.  We all want to find ways to speed the league calendar up, if possible, and to be honest, I feel many of us find any site work that is not advancing the offseason process as only a hinderance to that goal.  We also see how much work goes into the entire draft process, and also progressions and free agency, and would rather continue to move things forward, and possibly find room for small improvements in the game we have all been playing, than add more work for you and Jacobs.

     

    That said, if we continue to lose long-time players, even at a slow rate, and fail to replace them, we'll just die a slow death, and no one wants that.  It's one reason why I started with my "How to" series, to help train newer players.

     

    There's a balance to be found in there somewhere.  Especially if other players can somehow lighten the load by taking on more of the responsibilities, while allowing you and Jacobs to keep moving NFLHC forward.

     

    Personally, and I don't know if this could be an option, but I'd prefer to have the college game back, but only an incredibly bare bones version of it.  We recruit and set an offensive and defensive scheme (for the season, not every week), and it just gets simmed out.  The game would be recruiting and seeing the results, not so much the coaching aspect.  That game in itself would bring people to the site.  Once here and hooked, they can see what all the NFLHC fuss is about, especially as we continue to have those college players graduate to the Pros.  I think this would bring more people in than a USFL, XFL, NFL Europe Sim.  The recruiting for college is what brought me here originally.  Probably many others as well.  And the college part is in the name of the website.

     

    I'll help in any way that I can.  Thanks for trying to find new ways to play.

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    49 minutes ago, pumph said:

    We recruit and set an offensive and defensive scheme (for the season, not every week), and it just gets simmed out.  The game would be recruiting and seeing the results, not so much the coaching aspect.

    That’s really interesting. I could see us get a massive amount of people from this. 

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    I echo similar concerns as pumph.  I see this more as a way to get people involved than as a good development league.  I get that it's a fun idea, but I worry that this extra workload would delay or hinder progress with NFLHC.

     

    And to be clear, anything to keep people involved and interested I'm game for, but not at the expense of your sanity and NFLHC

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    7 hours ago, pumph said:

    All for setting up some kind of training ground for new players.  Unfortunately, the "Scout" positions, which are a great training ground to be shown the ropes, from the inside of a team, only have 9 of the 32 teams with someone in those roles at the moment, if the wiki is accurate.

     

    But anything that might slow down the schedule for NFLHC, I would be very much against.  We are an impatient lot, constantly asking for more info to be released, and yesterday, for all things pertaining to the offseason.  We all want to find ways to speed the league calendar up, if possible, and to be honest, I feel many of us find any site work that is not advancing the offseason process as only a hinderance to that goal.  We also see how much work goes into the entire draft process, and also progressions and free agency, and would rather continue to move things forward, and possibly find room for small improvements in the game we have all been playing, than add more work for you and Jacobs.

     

    That said, if we continue to lose long-time players, even at a slow rate, and fail to replace them, we'll just die a slow death, and no one wants that.  It's one reason why I started with my "How to" series, to help train newer players.

     

    There's a balance to be found in there somewhere.  Especially if other players can somehow lighten the load by taking on more of the responsibilities, while allowing you and Jacobs to keep moving NFLHC forward.

     

    Personally, and I don't know if this could be an option, but I'd prefer to have the college game back, but only an incredibly bare bones version of it.  We recruit and set an offensive and defensive scheme (for the season, not every week), and it just gets simmed out.  The game would be recruiting and seeing the results, not so much the coaching aspect.  That game in itself would bring people to the site.  Once here and hooked, they can see what all the NFLHC fuss is about, especially as we continue to have those college players graduate to the Pros.  I think this would bring more people in than a USFL, XFL, NFL Europe Sim.  The recruiting for college is what brought me here originally.  Probably many others as well.  And the college part is in the name of the website.

     

    I'll help in any way that I can.  Thanks for trying to find new ways to play.

    I agree with everything Pumph said

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    I like the idea and think we absolutely need a new way to engage and bring in new users because the long term site health is going to tank if there isnt new blood to replace users when they leave. At this point, outside of people returning to the site that have already left previously we have severely struggled to fill open spots.

    I understand the concern about simming the games causing potential delays in draft related things if it happens in the offseason. Even though it hasnt affected the ability for the league to function right now, if someone else leaves and we have two open franchises I expect there to be significant problems. You cant trade with an AI controlled team, who drafts for an AI controlled team, an AI team can't down dividend days or sign free agents. It is problematic to let a brand new user have a large part of a team because if only because of natural attrition of a new user. When you factor in the complexities of the site, specifically for a potential owner with no one underneath them it is essentially setting people up to fail.

     

    CFBHC used to be that initial engagement for the NFLHC side where people could get their feet wet and become engaged and without it we absolutely need a farm system. So I agree we absolutely need something new.

     

    Honestly my biggest concern for the proposed system is that it creates huge engagement gaps for the new people we are trying to bring in. If the developmental league is only during the offseason that means the new users can only come in during the offseason and then if they arent on an NFLHC team by the end of it have to hang around 4-6 months at best before their developmental team has anything to do again. 

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    I'm very much in agreement with the responses from most in the thread so far. I feel like we have been missing that gateway path for a more steady stream of people to test the waters, and maybe a developmental league could generate some interest. However, we're undoubtedly going to have current members want to take up a role to try it out, and it is really hard to sell a new person on being a subordinate in terms of getting a scout role.

     

    In terms of development of sim players, I think that with every season the talent pool gets wider of those mid level players that could be a roster level maybe a starter if they get their chance. Free agency is developing naturally as the first generation of players retire and leave behind career teams. It is a bummer to see some guys get lost in the void of free agency, but that's what happens in the world of football. Guys that don't establish themselves in the NFL fade away.

     

    With CFBHC in the past, we could look up a college careers worth of games and stats to try and find those hidden gems. I think that having full college stats is important in terms of preserving the historical continuity of the universe and providing information on the mid level players, but I know that's an absolute beast in terms of data and work. I totally understand if the sheer quantity and mass of cfbhc makes it difficult and taxing. 100-150+ teams worth of games, depth charts, gameplans, recruiting, conference drama, standings, whatever, is a just a ton of stuff. But, it gave people full autonomy of their own team. Some of us who have been here for a long time, myself included, have pretty much always had their way in how they want to run their team from the very beginning. You feel much more responsible. NFLHC scout is a cool role and I think it's a great option for someone who wants to be a part of the community in that capacity, but it's not super welcoming/inviting to brand new people. CFBHC let people build their own programs and have something to point to and say that's my team. Any reintroduction of cfbhc on any scale, would have my full support and backing.

     

     

     

     

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    I agree, we need to find a way to attract people so that it is not just the old guard hanging on. I am intrigued by the ideas pitched of once again using CFBHC as a gateway to the NFLHC. It sounds like reintroducing recruiting and making that work may be more administratively complex than something like NFL Europe? I'd like to see Soluna weigh in on that proposal, because I think if it is off the table we really should nix discussion on it here so we can move forward with what is actually on the table (and I think I speak for all of us in acknowledging how much we loved and miss CFBHC). If it is on the table though, by all means lets discuss it - I'm not trying to shut down conversation, just narrow down what is realistic in our options. It sounds like Soluna is soliciting input on the idea he has pitched (NFL Europe/USFL), so I'm trying to stay respectful of what he has asked us. 

     

    To that end, I am more in favor of the USFL. I just like that flavor a little more in all honestly because most of us are based in the US. I see it being more fun/realistic having people who never made it to the league or people who have flamed out being given a shot there. But, here is the problem. A bunch of people who have been around here 5,6,7+ years, myself included, are  weighing in for something that is not for them, but meant to be for new people. I'm curious what some of the newer guys here think. @Tranquility, @Saint Fleur, @willis4146. I think I tagged most of them lol. What do you guys think? You all joined after CFBHC ended iirc. Would this be a good pull for new people? 

     

     

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    I would not be in favor in expanding anything if it’s going to slow seasons for NFL down. @cultur3 and I have been together in the Cardinals FO for 46 months and we’ve completed 8 games of the 2021 season, and the entirety of the 2022-2024 seasons, and are nearing the end of the 2025 season. So essentially, 4.5 seasons in 46 months, which is like 10.25 months/season. Cultur3 and I are 15-57 as Chirp FO - we’ve won only 20% of our games, and you could say we could have done certain things different and maybe we’d have won 5-10 more games over that time, but the “gG yAlL aRe sPoOkY” gets old and I don’t want to wait literal years per season to “improve”, especially if it’s at the expense of a “developmental league” full of players who, realistically, should amount to nothing to the NFLHC (how many guys came out of the AoAF and XFL and are legitimately successful?)
     

    if I were a new user going to “USFL” or whatever, I would want more stats than the current iteration of CFB - if it’s just RB 17 carries, 103 yards, 2 TDs but we lost by 10, why did we lose and what happened? So I think they’d need basically a “full” box score or it wouldn’t be worthwhile, there wouldn’t be enough data to draw conclusions (which I also think about current CFB). 

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    18 hours ago, pumph said:

    Personally, and I don't know if this could be an option, but I'd prefer to have the college game back, but only an incredibly bare bones version of it.  We recruit and set an offensive and defensive scheme (for the season, not every week), and it just gets simmed out.  The game would be recruiting and seeing the results, not so much the coaching aspect.  That game in itself would bring people to the site.

     

    Hmm I wouldn't be opposed to this.

     

    Also, I don't think adding a minor NFL league would change the NFL schedule at all. It would just slot in while other stuff is going on. Hence 8 teams, it keeps the season relatively short while giving people stuff to do and everyone else more opportunity to scout lower level players.

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    6 hours ago, Todd said:

    I agree, we need to find a way to attract people so that it is not just the old guard hanging on. I am intrigued by the ideas pitched of once again using CFBHC as a gateway to the NFLHC. It sounds like reintroducing recruiting and making that work may be more administratively complex than something like NFL Europe? I'd like to see Soluna weigh in on that proposal, because I think if it is off the table we really should nix discussion on it here so we can move forward with what is actually on the table (and I think I speak for all of us in acknowledging how much we loved and miss CFBHC). If it is on the table though, by all means lets discuss it - I'm not trying to shut down conversation, just narrow down what is realistic in our options. It sounds like Soluna is soliciting input on the idea he has pitched (NFL Europe/USFL), so I'm trying to stay respectful of what he has asked us. 

     

    To that end, I am more in favor of the USFL. I just like that flavor a little more in all honestly because most of us are based in the US. I see it being more fun/realistic having people who never made it to the league or people who have flamed out being given a shot there. But, here is the problem. A bunch of people who have been around here 5,6,7+ years, myself included, are  weighing in for something that is not for them, but meant to be for new people. I'm curious what some of the newer guys here think. @Tranquility, @Saint Fleur, @willis4146. I think I tagged most of them lol. What do you guys think? You all joined after CFBHC ended iirc. Would this be a good pull for new people? 

     

     

     

    As I said in my response to pumph I'm not against that idea at all actually (for CFBHC) and think it's quite good. I just didn't think people would be interested in that aspect at all (except @DangerZoneh lol).

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    17 minutes ago, Soluna said:

     

    As I said in my response to pumph I'm not against that idea at all actually (for CFBHC) and think it's quite good. I just didn't think people would be interested in that aspect at all (except @DangerZoneh lol).

    I can't express how much I miss CFBHC, especially the recruiting part. 

     

    And, honestly, I think CFBHC would attract more player than doing a minor league, USFLF or NFL Europe.

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    22 minutes ago, Bruno said:

    I can't express how much I miss CFBHC, especially the recruiting part. 

     

    And, honestly, I think CFBHC would attract more player than doing a minor league, USFLF or NFL Europe.

    I'd participate in a USFL or Europe mini-league for sure, but I'd obviously take college back in a heartbeat. Either way could be a good gateway back into the time commitment needed for this tbh

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    1 hour ago, Soluna said:

     

    Hmm I wouldn't be opposed to this.

     

    Also, I don't think adding a minor NFL league would change the NFL schedule at all. It would just slot in while other stuff is going on. Hence 8 teams, it keeps the season relatively short while giving people stuff to do and everyone else more opportunity to scout lower level players.

    I am very much in favor of a reintroduction of CFBHC as I think it is a more natural way to get people excited for other aspects of the sim to get it rolling again.

     

    Getting a chance to interact with those last few classes I had at Texas Tech would mean a ton.

     

    41 minutes ago, Soluna said:

    What would people want from a reduced CFBHC in order?

     

    Recruiting + Setting a strategy for the year?

     

    What else?

    I understand that box scores are a bit of a touchy subject due to the amount of work for that many teams, but I would want to see more info in general about the game being played.  The CCGs had more detail which I liked, but I am unsure how to make it slightly more than that without it going super overboard back to full game reports and the workload getting nasty again.  Maybe a Box score with quarter by quarter breakdowns and a Passing leader, Rushing leader, Receiving Leader, and Defensive Standout for each team.  That way we still get to see those insane Sean Jenkins games from the 2016 season that captivated the site, but not making it as much of a huge time sink.

     

    Outside of that, I kinda don't know what I would want.  Not having to set a DC and just setting the scheme would be fine.  Maybe we can work on hiring and firing coaches?  Focus of school recruiting and development focus?

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    Is there a way instead of game reports, we get game results like we do today.   And then get a weekly stat file?  It helps to see how players play against top competition.  But also to see how guys play as they progress through college instead of just stats the final year once they're draft eligible.

     

    For recruiting I don't know how user interactive we can make it again.  Maybe each school can set target positions based on available recruits and the AI targets those positions heavier than other positions.

     

    For strategy, I think if we can have some say as far as aggressive vs passive, up tempo vs ball control, blitz heavy vs don't blitz, etc.

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    46 minutes ago, joedchi said:

    For recruiting I don't know how user interactive we can make it again.  Maybe each school can set target positions based on available recruits and the AI targets those positions heavier than other positions.

    I’ll pay for someone on fiverr to create a croot interface for us 

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    2 hours ago, Soluna said:

    What would people want from a reduced CFBHC in order?

     

    Recruiting + Setting a strategy for the year?

     

    What else?

    As others have said, I think full game reports would be a bit much, but if there were a way for you to more easily generate a spreadsheet of season stats, that would be super cool. 

     

    Could also do a Heisman ladder if you just wanted to highlight some players who are more likely to be top draft picks. 

     

    I also had the thought that it would be cool to have a spotlight game or two each week with a more in depth game report. Could do some media around it highlighting the teams and players playing. 

     

    I think some form of recruiting, however that would work best, as well as a starting strategy for the year would be plenty for coach interaction, I think.

     

    Honestly, as I type this out - given that the teams already have AI head coaches, having us technically play the role of AD could be an interesting avenue

     

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    I don't have enough time to add any more full game reports, the only way I could make enough time would be to remove the scoring box score from NFL. I could do quarter by quarter scoring for CFB maybe.

     

    Recruiting is probably gonna be rough too since we dont have an interface, so unless someone finds an alternative that'll be hard.

     

    @DangerZoneh I actually love the AD idea a lot, would make a lot of sense.

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